Voremon (old thread)

[Tastyboi]

If you were to remake it from scratch? Hmmmm... I can't think of anything specifically that I would want to see changed. Perhaps a way to give up in the Charizard fights instead of having to wait for everyone's HP to run out, both for if you wanted to see the vore scene as well if you know you won't be able to win and want to start over without going through all the text again. Another one could be possibly making Totodile a bit more useful, maybe let him keep a bit of the stats from when he was in the forest instead of returning all the way to level 1. It is helpful that he keeps the moves he learns, but since he still only have 3 PP, it makes it very limiting in boss fights, and the normal fights where the Pokemon are in a line and pop in after you defeat the one in front. Chansey also seemed to spam healing moves, at least in my playthroughs, making those fights annoyingly drawn out.

And just from wanting more vore, would also be fun seeing Tyranitar being gulped down after Charizard when you lose to Nidoqueen, but that might just be getting greedy haha

[foxyumbreon]

I know and okay. Also, I believe it was Gulpin and not Swalot if memory serves me correctly.

It's Swalot. I think I'd know. XP

Just downloaded the new version of the demo... love it! Great work!

One small bug I noticed -- in Dragonair's first stage, during the Snorlax chase, if you don't attack the second one from the top during its first charge, it won't charge again. This basically gives the player a safe lane that they can hide in and pick off the top Snorlax for an easy win.

Also, I love the addition of the Delibirds and the Prepped status -- not sure which build it was in, but it's new to me.

Of course, I tend to run into the Delibirds on purpose until I'm fully Prepped

FINALLY. After all these years, a possible trigger for the Snorlax glitch has been discovered. Now that I know where to look, maybe it can be fixed.

If you were to remake it from scratch? Hmmmm... I can't think of anything specifically that I would want to see changed. Perhaps a way to give up in the Charizard fights instead of having to wait for everyone's HP to run out, both for if you wanted to see the vore scene as well if you know you won't be able to win and want to start over without going through all the text again. Another one could be possibly making Totodile a bit more useful, maybe let him keep a bit of the stats from when he was in the forest instead of returning all the way to level 1. It is helpful that he keeps the moves he learns, but since he still only have 3 PP, it makes it very limiting in boss fights, and the normal fights where the Pokemon are in a line and pop in after you defeat the one in front. Chansey also seemed to spam healing moves, at least in my playthroughs, making those fights annoyingly drawn out.

And just from wanting more vore, would also be fun seeing Tyranitar being gulped down after Charizard when you lose to Nidoqueen, but that might just be getting greedy haha

Fortunately, most Charizard battles can be lost rather quickly when doing so deliberately. A lot of the enemies are excessively overpowered, especially if you don't use buffs and debuffs. And I had considered that addition with Totodile, but didn't want to break the game too much from what it already had been made to be tuned to him being at level one. That's why I decided to just give him a couple new moves instead, so the player doesn't feel like the forest was a total waste of time. I also like Totodile being considerably weaker than Charizard because of his implied age.

That would be a fun vore scene, maybe as an optional one. I personally think it's better to have it conclude with the hero eaten, but maybe an option would've been nice asking the player if they want to cut to the game over right there, or wait to see Tyranitar eaten as well.

[Pachirisu_And_Asmodeus]

I know and okay. Also, I believe it was Gulpin and not Swalot if memory serves me correctly.

It's Swalot. I think I'd know. XP

Just downloaded the new version of the demo... love it! Great work!

One small bug I noticed -- in Dragonair's first stage, during the Snorlax chase, if you don't attack the second one from the top during its first charge, it won't charge again. This basically gives the player a safe lane that they can hide in and pick off the top Snorlax for an easy win.

Also, I love the addition of the Delibirds and the Prepped status -- not sure which build it was in, but it's new to me.

Of course, I tend to run into the Delibirds on purpose until I'm fully Prepped

FINALLY. After all these years, a possible trigger for the Snorlax glitch has been discovered. Now that I know where to look, maybe it can be fixed.

If you were to remake it from scratch? Hmmmm... I can't think of anything specifically that I would want to see changed. Perhaps a way to give up in the Charizard fights instead of having to wait for everyone's HP to run out, both for if you wanted to see the vore scene as well if you know you won't be able to win and want to start over without going through all the text again. Another one could be possibly making Totodile a bit more useful, maybe let him keep a bit of the stats from when he was in the forest instead of returning all the way to level 1. It is helpful that he keeps the moves he learns, but since he still only have 3 PP, it makes it very limiting in boss fights, and the normal fights where the Pokemon are in a line and pop in after you defeat the one in front. Chansey also seemed to spam healing moves, at least in my playthroughs, making those fights annoyingly drawn out.

And just from wanting more vore, would also be fun seeing Tyranitar being gulped down after Charizard when you lose to Nidoqueen, but that might just be getting greedy haha

Fortunately, most Charizard battles can be lost rather quickly when doing so deliberately. A lot of the enemies are excessively overpowered, especially if you don't use buffs and debuffs. And I had considered that addition with Totodile, but didn't want to break the game too much from what it already had been made to be tuned to him being at level one. That's why I decided to just give him a couple new moves instead, so the player doesn't feel like the forest was a total waste of time. I also like Totodile being considerably weaker than Charizard because of his implied age.

That would be a fun vore scene, maybe as an optional one. I personally think it's better to have it conclude with the hero eaten, but maybe an option would've been nice asking the player if they want to cut to the game over right there, or wait to see Tyranitar eaten as well.

Hmmm, maybe I'm remembering wrong then.

[CharlieC]

FINALLY. After all these years, a possible trigger for the Snorlax glitch has been discovered. Now that I know where to look, maybe it can be fixed.

Happy to be of service!

[jdb1984]

I may have put myself in a near unwinnable situation. I have to face Snorlax with 1 hit left, and even dying and retrying doesn't restore her (yes, I decided Dragonair is female) HP. Plus I missed the underwater game over. So it looks like I may have to start from the beginning to get the underwater defeat and get in a better position to win.

[foxyumbreon]

I may have put myself in a near unwinnable situation. I have to face Snorlax with 1 hit left, and even dying and retrying doesn't restore her (yes, I decided Dragonair is female) HP. Plus I missed the underwater game over. So it looks like I may have to start from the beginning to get the underwater defeat and get in a better position to win.

There's a glitch mentioned involving Snorlax on the previous page of this thread (somewhere near the bottom) that can make beating Snorlax a breeze.

[foxyumbreon]

It's been a bit since I asked about people's own ideas, and partly because of the journal I started asking myself how I would answer it myself. Without anything else to do while walking home from work the past few days, I've put some thought into what I think Voremon may roughly look like if I remade it. For the sake of discussion, I thought I'd give you all the lowdown. Keep in mind though that this is all rather rough, so there might be some missing details, or things not quite fanned out or designed as deeply as it would be by time it would be actually used.

Getting Started:
The game would begin relatively the same. It would begin with four tutorial stages starring the four heroes to get the story started, and teach the player how to play the game. The character order would be the same as well, as would the bosses. Aside from some gameplay changes though (which I haven't worked out enough to discuss in this post) things would be rather familiar until you beat these first four stages.

Character Select:
After beating Stage 4, you'd be taken to a character select screen, allowing you to choose which of the four pokemon who's story you wish to progress. You could go about this any way you want, from alternating, to focusing on one character, to completely dismissing some others. At the end, each character would have their own final boss fight against Vore Lord, and their own ending (though the endings wouldn't be drastically different, primarily just affecting which of the heroes eats Vore Lord). However, like all good things, there would be a catch.

While you could just play through with your favorites, only by beating all four scenarios would you be granted access to the true ending, as well as an unlockable fifth scenario based on the Voremon sequel I've hinted at in the past. That way the player would be encouraged to beat it with everybody in order to actually complete the story, but wouldn't be required to if they just can't stand one or two gameplay styles so much that to them, seeing the whole plot unfold just isn't worth the nuisance.

Difficulty:
The game's primary difficulty would be relatively easy so even a novice could breeze through the game. However, for those willing to work for it (explained further along), there would be unlockable difficulty settings to push players who want a challenge to the limit.

Stage Design:
Stages would be completely redesigned. Rather than being linear going from room to room, each one would involve a map. Every map would contain various areas to tackle, with all of them able to be revisited (the stages could also be revisited after completion). The areas would be divided into categories.

Main areas would be the bulk of the game, and the areas you need to clear to progress along the map. Clearing them would grant you access to the next, while completing them while meeting special conditions would sometimes give you access to secret areas. Some of these special conditions may include finding a secret exit leading to an alternate path, or beating the area without taking damage to gain access to a challenge area that may unlock a higher difficulty for your efforts.

Village/Captive areas would be places where you have the opportunity to rescue other pokemon from Vore Lord's forces, either be saving them from ovens in a facility, defending a village under attack, or whatever. I'm not sure yet exactly what I would do with them to make them more than just additional stages to play for fun, or for completionists. Maybe something like added skills you can learn by rescuing certain numbers of pokemon that'll aid you on higher difficulties, or something.

That's all the types of areas I can think of right now, but I'd probably try to come up with more. Maybe smaller things were you have to accomplish a single task as small obstacles in between the larger areas. Maybe something like you wander onto a Vore Lord hunting ground for snagging wild pokemon, and have to carefully navigate the traps to avoid being captured.

Difficulty Progression:
The game would start rather easy, and if you want a higher difficult you'd have to work for it. Meeting conditions such as clearing an area without taking damage would open the way to more challenging areas than the norm. These would, in essence, be the higher difficulty, as they'd likely also allow advancement through the stage, and clearing them would determine the difficulty setting you could chose for the boss.

For example, let's say a stage consists of 4 main areas before the boss. You'd start on the easiest one. By beating it without taking damage, you'd unlock both the 2nd easy main area, and the first main area on the next difficulty. Which path you follow to the boss would determine the boss's strength (likely with the boss being indicated on different map points to simplify selection as you unlock more difficulties).

Likely on the first main area in a stage on each branch would have the option to unlock a harder one, while the others would possibly have other branching paths such as to towns, or other special areas. Of course, to keep things from being too overwhelming, I doubt EVERY main area would have a branching path, but maybe if I could come up with enough different types of stages to keep it from becoming too much.

That's all I can think of for now, and this post has gotten long enough already, so I'll leave it at that.

[Nibor]

While reading the previous post, I found myself thinking "This sounds really good, and doable, if not time-consuming...." I'd enjoy going through the game if you actually considered remaking it like this, Foxy.....

[Deioth]

Should you commit to a remake, will you use something other than RPGMaker? For your needs, it simply lacks the necessary control. I'd imagine using something more from scratch like XNA Framework or perhaps Game Maker. So much of the challenge of normal is just a matter of fighting the engine rather than the game.

[foxyumbreon]

Should you commit to a remake, will you use something other than RPGMaker? For your needs, it simply lacks the necessary control. I'd imagine using something more from scratch like XNA Framework or perhaps Game Maker. So much of the challenge of normal is just a matter of fighting the engine rather than the game.

I'll never use any game creator other than RPG Maker. It's what I've been using for 13 years, and I have no interest in learning something new.

[Pachirisu_And_Asmodeus]

Should you commit to a remake, will you use something other than RPGMaker? For your needs, it simply lacks the necessary control. I'd imagine using something more from scratch like XNA Framework or perhaps Game Maker. So much of the challenge of normal is just a matter of fighting the engine rather than the game.

I'll never use any game creator other than RPG Maker. It's what I've been using for 13 years, and I have no interest in learning something new.

That's understandable, and I have to admit that your alternate ideas sound like they'd make for a fun game. The only change I'd make to them would be if you beat everyone's scenario, you'd unlock the true final stage where you'd learn that the Vore Lord each of them beat was only the true Vore Lord's Shadow and in that unlocked stage, you'd use all four of them in a fight against the real Vore Lord.

[foxyumbreon]

Should you commit to a remake, will you use something other than RPGMaker? For your needs, it simply lacks the necessary control. I'd imagine using something more from scratch like XNA Framework or perhaps Game Maker. So much of the challenge of normal is just a matter of fighting the engine rather than the game.

I'll never use any game creator other than RPG Maker. It's what I've been using for 13 years, and I have no interest in learning something new.

That's understandable, and I have to admit that your alternate ideas sound like they'd make for a fun game. The only change I'd make to them would be if you beat everyone's scenario, you'd unlock the true final stage where you'd learn that the Vore Lord each of them beat was only the true Vore Lord's Shadow and in that unlocked stage, you'd use all four of them in a fight against the real Vore Lord.

That wouldn't be a bad idea, to help keep Vore Lord's identity secret from those not willing to go the extra mile. Not sure if I would actually do so though. Would depend on how I would be able to work that in, while still making my already existing plans work as well.

[foxyumbreon]

Vital Voremon Remake Discussion:

Since I'm currently not making any progress with my projects lately anyway due to other things going on, and some interest in the ideas I pitched for a remake, I figure I might as well give it some consideration. However, I'm not going to just do something like that on a whim, so it's time to discuss it.

If it's going to happen, I want to talk about it in depth. Discuss ideas with people, talk about thoughts and feelings about such an undertaking. I'm not talking small, one paragraph posts either. I don't have enough ideas myself to make this work how I'd like, so it won't happen without helpful and constructive discussion and debate. If you really want to see the game remade, now's the time to have your voice heard. Bring up additional thoughts about what I've already mentioned, new ideas all of your own, or whatever. Hopefully I'll find time and the mood to pick things back up a bit in a couple months or so, depending on how various things go. However long it takes, if things start back up before I'm convinced that remaking the game is worth it, and will get the support needed to actually get the game completed, then it won't happen.

In relation to that, I was thinking a bit more about it myself recently, getting to thinking that all the characters should have some form of combat. I only came up with ideas so far for Umbreon and Lucario, based on their current gameplay mechanics, and if possible would like to have similar ideas implemented to Charizard and Dragonair as well.

With both characters, battle would start when you collide with an enemy (besides Delibird, of course). The battle details are as follows:

Umbreon: You'd be transported to a small chamber with a gauge on top of the screen displaying Umbreon, and the enemy pokemon. The room would have buttons spread about, and a step counter. You objective would be to press all the buttons with as few steps taken as possible. Every time the step counter reaches 0, the enemy would attack, dealing Umbreon 1 point of damage. Bosses would likely be remade to work in this same fashion, but with more health and complex obstacles, as well as possibly some other hindrances such as the player taking damage if they dilly-dally. Some rooms might also reflect the enemy being battled, such as an ice-type having slippery floors, or a poison-type having toxic panels that count as multiple steps to cross.

Lucario: Lucario would be relatively the same as Umbreon, except rather than being hit every number of steps, it would be based on a timer. The rooms would also likely be more maze and puzzle heavy, whereas Umbreon's would be more about figuring out which path will require the least number of steps based on where all the buttons are in relation to each other, and other varying factors and obstacles. Unlike Umbreon's bosses, Lucario's would likely stay the same, or very similar, to how they are now.

Additionally, I was thinking I'd add a Stamina meter that drops every time you fight, so you can't just plow through all the enemies. If you're hit by an enemy (outside of battle) while it's at zero, you're too tired to defend yourself, and get a game over.

Of course, I don't want to only discuss that battle idea. I want to discuss every possible aspect of the game. I just thought I'd throw that in there as a bit more to start on, in addition to what's already been said about ideas before, or something entirely different that hasn't at all been touched yet. Everything's up for discussion, so have at it, or things stay the way they are.

[Pachirisu_And_Asmodeus]

I think those ideas are good ones. I also think having panels spread out in every stage that replenish health and stamina would be a good idea too, although maybe make them one use only to prevent players from overusing them. They could be a lot rarer in later stages too, and maybe at first in Umbreon stages it could be somewhat easy to press all the buttons without getting attacked, but against later foes, you'd have to use the absolute minimum number of steps possible if you wanted to do so. For the minigames, I think they're fine as it is.

In the Lucario stages, when you touch a pokemon, you could be sent to a room where you have to solve a puzzle within a time limit with each species having their own puzzle. At first, it could be easy to complete the puzzles, but it could get more and more difficult as time goes on. Some ideas include:

Hitmonlee: Step on each panel once and only once.

Abra: Get to the switch without being seen by Abra. Abra can teleport to different locations too, and does so every few secondes, facing a new direction every time.

Butterfree: The room is filled with pockets of sleeping powder floating around. You need to get to the other side of the room without falling asleep.

Probopass: No change

Charizard's stages: I don't think they need to be changed at all.

Dragonair's stages: When you touch an enemy, you get transported to a short mini dungeon you have to get through and at the end of that dungeon, you face a horde of the pokemon that you touched as the boss. Warning: You don't want to get touched by Ponyta if he does do this. You definately don't want to face a horde of them.

[foxyumbreon]

Those are all good ideas, but at this rate it's not looking like those battles will be used. Other people on other sites have provided some rather good insight on why they shouldn't be done. I still appreciate the input though, just in case they do happen should a remake occur. As for why I was wanting a new battle type for Charizard though, it's because the 5th scenario would also focus on combat, much more so and in a more classical RPG style fashion (with random battles, leveling, etc) and as such if everybody was going to have their own battle style, I figured it best to apply something new to Charizard so it didn't match the combat for the 5th scenario.

[Pachirisu_And_Asmodeus]

Ah okay. That makes sense.

[foxyumbreon]

I've gone through over the past couple days and fixed just about all of the reported glitches and such from the last demo, as well as some other things that weren't reported. These fixes should allow the game to run much more smoothly come the next release. I also made a couple small changes to some of the more frustrating parts of Stage 9 that have so far been released. I removed one of the buttons in the puzzle where you first meet Muk that had always really frustrated me, making that part feel a bit more well thought out, and less annoying to fix should you make a mistake. Also, because of the unforeseen complications in the Pidgeotto room, I added a small groove on the bottom where the player can practice their timing against the wind shots passing overhead before diving into the fray if they're having difficulty getting it down amidst the fire. If that doesn't help, then good luck, because that room is primarily meant as a warm up for things to come, to force the player to get down their timing in preparation for the more difficult parts of the stage where those skills are a must for preserving your HP. It should also help that one of the glitches I fixed involved retrying after losing the Sharpedo minigame was sending you back to the start of the stage, rather than the start of that room as it should've been.

Also, I've come up with an idea to make the game easier for those who want it that way. Starting with the next demo, I'll start releasing alongside it an easier version of the game for those who want things to be a bit simpler. The easy version will be relatively the same as the original (including having both normal difficulty options available), with the exception that all player stats, as well as Lucario's timer, are doubled. The difficulty of minigames will remain the same.

Also, as the above information may imply, I've decided against the remaking of Voremon.

[jdb1984]

You can climb into an oven and commit suicide in stage 5?

[foxyumbreon]

You can climb into an oven and commit suicide in stage 5?

That was added because people were pointing out frustration from getting irreversibly stuck in that room with no way to remedy the issue other than reloading the game. So I put those ovens there as a safety just in case you get yourself stuck, and have already used up your once-per-floor reset.

[foxyumbreon]

This question is only for those who have encountered the Pidgeotto room in Stage 9.

I've come up with a way to make the room less frustrating in the sense that you won't be blown into the water constantly and then have to start over, but at the same time in a sense more challenging because it will involve the player instead taking damage every time when hit. Other than that, the room would remain relatively the same, so I thought I'd ask which players would prefer.

PS: I've fixed the glitch that causes the retry option when you lose the Sharpedo minigame to return you back to the start of the stage.