Questions you cannot ask?

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Questions you cannot ask?

Postby 157and493 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:25 am

Something I have noticed is that a lot of vore artists dislike it if you ask about the gender of the predator when it is not listed in the tags or made clear in some other way. Normally the responses I get when inquiring about the predator’s gender are: “Does it really matter?” “Why are you asking?” “If you don’t like the picture then leave.” “Their gender is whatever you want it to be.” “It’s suppose to be ambiguous.” “Is that all you care about?” “I did not really think about it.”
To be fair, most of those responses are polite and respectable even if they do not completely answer the question so most people do not seem to mind but there is still a small handful who do. Still, an artist is under no obligation to explain their work and I should be thankful that they even took the time to respond to me at all. I was just wondering though, is there any particular reason this question tends to get under people’s skin?

I am not trying to be rude or sarcastic here, I am genuinely curious.
Last edited by 157and493 on Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:50 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby cranberryknights1 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:10 am

Hmm,based on what you said I think in those cases the artist is likely uncomfortable putting a gender label on there pred and even if your asking politely it makes them feel like they have to decide one or the other to give you a answer which irritates them and causes them to respond to you rudely like telling you to leave even if all you did was ask that simple question. Whether that's the case or something else there's no real reason to respond like that though and those artist need to chill.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby EnderDracolich » Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:20 am

Artists should never be rude if you ask a simple question.

If they don't want questions, they should specify that in the comments section.

Inquiry is a normal part of the process of appreciating art.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby MotherOfMonsters » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:37 am

I feel Cranberry is pretty close with this. In my experience drawing for this community, predator gender can be a cause of friction, and I have--on rare occasion--gotten rude comments based on drawing or not drawing a certain gender.
So if someone asked me the gender of an ambiguous predator, I'd assume they're asking because they care about the gender. And if they care about gender enough to ask, they may have preferences strong enough to become angry or aggressive if I give a 'wrong answer.'
Being given a pop-quiz with those stakes could make me defensive; even if the person asking is probably very reasonable, there's a potential threat which I've been bitten by before.

That said, if you're being polite, you keep doing you. I just felt this glimpse of artist-anxiety might be interesting to you (though I can only speak for myself).
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby again__again » Thu Sep 12, 2019 7:49 am

i would be curious, as a counter question, if the pred's gender is so ambiguous that you feel the urge to ask, why not just imagine it as whatever gender you prefer it to be? once you ask, you open yourself up to getting an answer you dont want, so why not let the ambiguity benefit you?
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby iWasFrozenToday » Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:10 am

For me, the gender of the predator is very important. (The gender of the prey almost never worries me even if it isn’t specifically male or female, seeing as their fate is digestion in most of my choice content.) This is because I’m a male who’s into females: Since this Vore Fantasy is an amplified version of this desire; though it be greater, there are some things that I am not willing to change because it would be too “out of bounds.” Male preds don’t do it for me because I only like females in this way, and if I’m not even able to tell what gender the pred is, then that pred has even less of a chance of resonating with me.

So I guess it depends on where each individual has drawn the line. The people who ask the same questions as OP are likely have a line themselves, and they just want to know if the character they’re about to get all invested in is in or out of bounds for them personally. What better way to receive confirmation than by asking the creator?

Overall, the creators who tell you to back off are only ruining how others may receive their characters in my opinion. “Whatever you want it to be” is fair enough, I guess, but if that person is like me and desires an amount of certainty in whatever answer they get, I'm afraid an answer like that just won’t cut it, and that would usually be the point where someone like me would move on.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby iWasFrozenToday » Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:23 am

again__again wrote:i would be curious, as a counter question, if the pred's gender is so ambiguous that you feel the urge to ask, why not just imagine it as whatever gender you prefer it to be? once you ask, you open yourself up to getting an answer you dont want, so why not let the ambiguity benefit you?

Often when I like a character, I want to know more about them. When you decide you want to know more, you are drawing a double-edged sword. What you learn can make your passion, and what you learn can break your passion. It’s all up to the viewers if they want to draw the sword. Some eagerly do, and some don’t even look at the blade either out of disconcern or fear: Fear that the character they once stood by has traits and qualities that, when they are revealed, ultimately tarnish the character for them.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby Mokii » Thu Sep 12, 2019 10:44 am

iWasFrozenToday wrote:Overall, the creators who tell you to back off are only ruining how others may receive their characters in my opinion. “Whatever you want it to be” is fair enough, I guess, but if that person is like me and desires an amount of certainty in whatever answer they get, I'm afraid an answer like that just won’t cut it, and that would usually be the point where someone like me would move on.


And there's absolutely nothing with moving on and I think that's a little melodramatic to call it "ruining".

While the gender thing isn't an issue for me there are certain questions that push my buttons and honestly if what I'm creating doesn't do it for somebody then it's perfectly fair that they just move on. I'm under no obligation to satisfy every question that comes my way just like people that consume our content have no obligation to stick with an artist if they're not getting something that makes them happy.

To be fair I don't think an artist should be rude out of the gate, but you have to understand sometimes we get questions that push our buttons over and over again and sometimes people can be quite pushy with it which can lead to artist being a little bit cynical when they get those certain questions.

Just as an example for me I tend to draw stuff that's the sort of the "moment before" the vore happens or it's right in the middle, I very rarely draw aftermath and I had someone that would always ask me about it and then it got to the point where he was following me around back when I used to post on another website and comment on every vore picture that I did saying it wasn't Vore because I wasn't drawing aftermath.

That irritated me so much that I actually would get almost instantly aggravated if someone asked me about afterrmath and I'd have to watch my tone when replying to them.

Just got to remember the artists are people too and you don't know what kind of stuff they may have had to deal with and a question as simple as what a gender something is might aggravate them if they've been bugged about it constantly before and prefer not to assign one.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby MaxTwenty » Thu Sep 12, 2019 11:28 am

Pretty much echo Mokii's sentiments here. Otherwise couple points I'd like to add or expound.

If the artist thinks the gender is self-explanatory and someone misses the gender or asks to be sure, that's kind of telling the artist they failed to communicate it through the art itself. Failure isn't the end of the world, but depending on where they are mood- and confidence-wise at the moment it can sting like hell or deflate their drive. It's a thing anyone needs to get used to in any pursuit, art or otherwise, but it never really gets to be pleasant. So I guess it isn't really adding a point here but echoing that artists are people who will react like people.

Second, there really are a lot of people (not all, not the majority, not even a big percentage to be honest, but enough) who act entitled about art and ruin it for everyone else. Spending a bunch of time on a piece, feeling like you nailed it, and then having the first comment be "Is the pred female?" with the intent behind the question *actually* being "Because if not it's ruined" can seriously be a slap in the face. You can't please everyone with anything, but having the genuinely entitled types come out of the woodwork can be emotionally draining. Especially if, as Mokii said, they're the type to follow you around and gatekeep or harass you into drawing what they want.

At the end of it I think artists and commenters could both do well to chill out a bit and not read negative intent into things unless it's confirmable. Personally I upload stuff a while after I'm done with it now, or hold off on reading the comments until I'm a bit less worked raw to compensate. If a picture doesn't match your preferences... move on, I suppose? One thing I'd like to respond to a little:

iWasFrozenToday wrote:Overall, the creators who tell you to back off are only ruining how others may receive their characters in my opinion. “Whatever you want it to be” is fair enough, I guess, but if that person is like me and desires an amount of certainty in whatever answer they get, I'm afraid an answer like that just won’t cut it, and that would usually be the point where someone like me would move on.


I wouldn't say there's audacity in asking or anything, but "Just won't cut it" does sound a little like being owed a particular answer? If you (or anyone) are doing this, please be civil and considerate. Even ghosting after a response if it's not what you wanted can contribute to artists getting their backs up when they're asked something like this.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby Scrumptious » Thu Sep 12, 2019 12:59 pm

Gender is a really raw nerve right now - for good reasons - and people here on this forum have their art and their sexuality hanging on those raw nerves. Also, in online settings, some people are really polite and other people are really rude, and written language does not have the tonality to communicate emotion very well. As a result, many people assume bad faith rather than good faith. Those assumptions may come from a history of abuse, or they may be the result of a bad donut that the person just ate.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby ArcaneSigil » Thu Sep 12, 2019 3:01 pm

The way I view it... gender is a touchy subject these days simply because of the LGBTQ-whatever the hell the acronym is anymore. I've seen so many changes to that damned acronym I don't care anymore. I'm accepting of people who have changed genders or identify as the opposite gender, but seriously? There are Four. Lesbian, Gay, Bi, or Trans. I don't know what Q stands for (I'm sure I asked somewhere and someone told me but it was TO ME a stupid thing so I spaced it out). Seriously, there are only two genders. Trans isn't a third gender, it's short for TRANSITION, which means going from one gender to another. If you're Lesbian, you're a girl attracted to girls. If you're gay, you're a guy attracted to guys. If you're Bi, you're attracted to both genders. I don't know what Q means, but if you're not attracted to any genders, it's not some special word. Just means you're Asexual. Not... whatever the word is.

I can feel myself getting angrier the more about this I write, so I'll close with this. Gender is a touchy subject because so many people have started viewing gender as fluid and not a simple factor of life and reality of which you are. You are either a guy attracted a guys, a girl attracted to girls, a person attracted to both, or a person attracted to none. If you're trans, you're going from one gender to another for some reason or another. It doesn't make you a different sexuality. Trans folks could be gay guys who want to be girls or lesbian girls who want to be guys. In closing... gender is too touchy a subject to continue on, much like politics, so any conversations about it should be kept short and sweet.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby Artemis » Thu Sep 12, 2019 4:18 pm

Some people believe that "no gender", "mystery gender" or perhaps "herm" are one-size-fits-all answers to sexual attraction. They feel a lot of contempt toward gender conceptually and are unable to empathize with people who don't share this contempt. Thus, they get mad when someone reminds them that other preferences exist by asking a legitimate question.

My advice if someone responds to you that way; Leave 'em be. There's nothing you can do to help and they're being hostile when asked basic questions. Nothing good can come from continuing to talk to them.

Out of all the example responses you gave, these are the good ones:

“It’s suppose to be ambiguous.”
“I did not really think about it.”
And of course, choosing to ignore the question if they don't want to answer it.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby C107galaxytachyon » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:18 pm

This may/may not be related to what’s already been discussed here, but is it ever inherently wrong to set any story commission as an AU successor to one made by someone else? (Assuming not a single OC is present in either work.)
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby sweetladyamy » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:43 pm

Sometimes, there are those that would rather not have perceived gender already established, and mayhaps, it isn't needed for whatever reason/s may apply. But asking a question is not a bad thing; expecting a certain answer is, but it is just as bad for the one to answer the inquiry in a manner that only makes the tension worse.

As for me, I can't say I've ever done this, though I will say that most of the time, my work reflects the self-identity of the characters than whatever already-established roles most people see with their...

(not going there)
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby Brazzel » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:48 pm

C107galaxytachyon wrote:This may/may not be related to what’s already been discussed here, but is it ever inherently wrong to set any story commission as an AU successor to one made by someone else? (Assuming not a single OC is present in either work.)


Whether it is inherently wrong is up for debate, but I believe that if you ask the creator and they say no, then the creator has the final word. What would be wrong is that sometimes I see people harass the creator in their comments, shouts, and PM's by asking over and over again despite the creator having said explicitly that they don't want any AU's. Those people really need to let it go.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby cranberryknights1 » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:50 pm

C107galaxytachyon wrote:This may/may not be related to what’s already been discussed here, but is it ever inherently wrong to set any story commission as an AU successor to one made by someone else? (Assuming not a single OC is present in either work.)




I don't think its wrong but it may polite to get the permission or approval from the original author first just so there's no chance for any misunderstanding or disagreement about it.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby Progressive » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:50 pm

C107galaxytachyon wrote:This may/may not be related to what’s already been discussed here, but is it ever inherently wrong to set any story commission as an AU successor to one made by someone else? (Assuming not a single OC is present in either work.)


Brazzel wrote:Whether it is inherently wrong is up for debate, but I believe that if you ask the creator and they say no, then the creator has the final word. What would be wrong is that sometimes I see people harass the creator in their comments, shouts, and PM's by asking over and over again despite the creator having said explicitly that they don't want any AU's. Those people really need to let it go.


As a rule of thumb: whether you are creating a piece for a commission or paying for one, you should always ask for the original creator's blessing before using their work. If you do not receive that blessing, then using their work against their wishes is wrong.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby soline » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:55 pm

This seems like a weirdly specific thing to need to ask consistently enough to get such a range of responses you start to feel it's a touchy subject. I'm a pretty prolific lurker and can't say I come across too much content that's so ambiguous I have absolutely no idea which gender a character is.

So with that in mind I guess my question is what exactly are you asking, and what's the context of asking it? A lot of your example responses seem particularly stand-offish or hostile, but there are also a few that I thoroughly resonate with 'It's supposed to be ambiguous' for example. I get the occasional questions about my art which trend along the lines of 'so what happens next/is this fatal?' and my responses are usually it's up to the viewer. I feel like to give a response like that, they would have to be phrased in a way that seriously made me feel like "Because otherwise this is shit and I hate fatal stuff" is the unspoken end to their question.


Moving beyond you personally, since this seems as a topic to be a lot less 'questions you cannot ask' and more 'asking about gender is touchy' I have to fall back on saying it seems a weirdly specific problem and I imagine that's the reason you're not getting totally chummy answers. If the gender is ambiguous then either it's supposed to be, or it's not supposed to be and the artist wasn't clear enough, or it's really just not important in the artist's eye and picture's design. In all three cases asking isn't a positive experience for reasons ranging from implying the artist sucks to trying to force them to answer an unanswerable question.

I do wonder why it's important at all to be honest. I appreciate preferences and sexual tastes and fully get, for example, if you just don't find male predators attractive. However knowing the gender doesn't really affect that beyond your own subjective sense of sexual narrative. If the predator is blatantly a guy and you don't like that. Cool. If the predator is blatantly a girl and you do. Cool. If the predator could be either and you like or don't like that. Also cool. But if it could be either and you do like it, but are so put off the concept of liking it if it turns out to be a male that you're driven to get a definite answer from the artist (effectively making them decide if you like or don't like something.) then I think that's on you, and probably not a very healthy mindset.

Also a bit of total speculation. Given the context and CrimsonFang's little rant above I do find myself wondering if this question is less targeted at 'ambiguous tentacle monster with no clear gender that I want to know if it's a female or male monster' and more aimed at trans/traps/femboys/androgynous/otherwise-deliberately-'non-stereotypically-gendered' artwork that doesn't present specifically one way or the other; in which case would quite rightly prompt a hostile response since it will always read pretty clearly as an attempt to passively-aggressively dismiss those kinds of characters.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby Erastus » Thu Sep 12, 2019 5:58 pm

If I leave something up to interpretation, then my intention is for you to imagine whatever you want. Whatever was left ambiguous was not the important part to me, or (in rarer cases) maybe it was important to me that it be ambiguous. If I don't tag a gender, then there is no specific gender intended and I don't care what you imagine it to be.
Depending on how you ask, it can come off as you either accusing the artist of not tagging their work properly or assuming that they MUST have some "head canon" for whatever it is you're asking about. Nothing wrong with asking politely if the artist's intention matters that much to you, but don't be surprised or disappointed if the answer is "Whatever you want", because if something is left that ambiguous in the first place, it was probably intentional.
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Re: Questions you cannot ask?

Postby Mokii » Thu Sep 12, 2019 6:31 pm

soline wrote:If the predator could be either and you like or don't like that. Also cool. But if it could be either and you do like it, but are so put off the concept of liking it if it turns out to be a male that you're driven to get a definite answer from the artist (effectively making them decide if you like or don't like something.) then I think that's on you, and probably not a very healthy mindset.


This is the best way I have seen it put to be honest.
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